Few Dutch metal bands have built a career quite like Epica. As the band approaches its 25th anniversary, the momentum surrounding them feels stronger than ever — from three sold-out shows at the iconic Royal Theater Carré to the success of their latest album, Aspiral. In this special and exclusive interview, conducted in Dutch, I speak with Coen Janssen about the upcoming anniversary celebrations, the evolution of Epica’s sound over the years, and the challenge of continuing to innovate after nearly a quarter century as a band.
Welcome to Coen Janssen from Epica
First of all, welcome, Coen. And congratulations on three dates at Carré Theater in Amsterdam – all sold out.
Thank you.
I’ll be there on Friday, but I didn’t manage to get tickets for the other two. There might be a second chance, I don’t know. I really didn’t expect everything to go so fast.
No, we didn’t expect that either. We thought: of course, if we announce our 25th anniversary and a special show, it will sell quickly. And Carré isn’t the usual size of venue we play. So we expected it to go fast. But that it would go this fast, and that we’d eventually be able to add a third show – we really didn’t see that coming.
The Epica show at Her Carré
Let me put it this way: I once went to Carré for the Canadian folk/Celtic singer Loreena McKennitt – a completely different setting. When I read “Epica in Carré,” I thought: okay, that’s something very different from what I’d expect there. So I found it both exciting and surprisingly beautiful as a location.
Yes, we want to kick off our anniversary properly. For that, we wanted a beautiful venue – in any case, something different from usual. Carré was very high on our wish list. It’s such an iconic hall. It’s not a place where bands easily get to play, but it means something to all Dutch people. Hopefully we can also put on a great show there.
Speculating on…
I’m very curious, because it’s 25 years, as you just said. You can really play with that. I’m also a bit curious about your choice of setlist.
Exciting, isn’t it? We can’t play everything anyway; there just isn’t enough time.
For such a big setlist, I imagine you’d be looking at about two and a half hours. But I guess you’re not planning to follow Bruce Springsteen, who plays almost three hours live every night.
Exactly. And with the various Kingdom of Heaven songs, you could easily go over four or five hours if you counted everything. So that’s not going to happen, no. Of course we’re going to try to cover all eras. How exactly we’ll do that, I’m not going to reveal yet.
Of course I would ask that , but I also want to be a little surprised. I’ve been here from the very beginning, so I say: just vary, and I’ll see what comes next – without spoilers. I think that’s the best way.
Yes [laughs].
Speculating on.. [part 2]
You’ve announced: 25 years of Epica. My next question is: are you planning any reissues? There are a few releases that are completely sold out and go for sky‑high prices on Discogs. Some records can’t be found at all anymore. I’m thinking of The Classical Conspiracy and Retrospect. Is there any chance those might be re-released?
That’s a very good question, actually. I hadn’t really thought about that. That’s usually something that goes a bit beyond the creative side. As musicians, we mainly focus on the creative side.
I understand.
And on putting shows together. Then you have the business side – managers, record labels, and so on. They’re all hard at work. Let me leave it at that, otherwise I’ll end up saying something I’m not allowed to say, or misjudge something, and then I’ll promise things that won’t happen. Anyway, we did reissue all the early records a few years ago.
Yes, that’s right.
Still speculating on the discography of Epica
Most fans were really happy with that. So could we do something like that again? Yes, who knows?
And for collectors it would also be nice to have, for example, a box set with all kinds of singles. Yes, I’m really into that, so I keep thinking of ideas. And I’m also willing to invest in it; that’s why I bring it up. I’m giving you bad ideas as well. Bad for my wallet.
And good for your wallet [laughs].
The epic show at the Ziggo Dome
I attended to the Ziggo Dome concert this February. I was in the Golden Circle. What a great show. I still keep congratulating you on that night. I really loved it – the lights, the setlist… So I wanted to ask: how does a band put together a show that big? Because a stage like that in the Ziggo Dome is pretty impressive.
It always starts with us having a new record. A tour is basically there to promote that new record. So you try to build a setlist that highlights that album. It’s our newest music, we’re very proud of it, and we want to play as much of it as possible.
Of course, you can’t just play new songs, because then everyone gets upset. Or at least, some people get upset very quickly. It’s never completely right for everyone. You try to serve everyone, so you add a few classics, and maybe a few songs in a different shape or arrangement.
The epic show at the Ziggo Dome [part 2]
We sit down with Jens, who does a lot for us. Then we look at: how are we going to do this? What stage design do we take? What kind of production? That’s where it starts, and from there it gradually gets filled in. On this tour, we really wanted it to feel like a complete show – not just songs in a row, but something where everything fits together and flows into each other.
We wanted people to feel, with every song: hey, something new is happening, something special is going on here. And that worked out very well. For the Ziggo Dome – because that was the biggest show of the whole tour – we went all out. You make everything a bit bigger, add more effects, and so on.
Choosing a setlist for a show
You said it’s almost impossible to make everyone happy with a setlist, and that’s true. I’m on Facebook, so I read a bit of the sentiment after the show. Some people loved the Aspiral songs; others were disappointed because they missed an old banger. Personally, I thought it was a very well-balanced setlist. When you release such a big album, you have to play at least five or six songs from it.
Well, you don’t have to. Some people still come only for The Phantom Agony and don’t care about the rest. But either way, you never get it 100% right. And there are six of us in the band; we all have our own favorites. Some of us want to play certain songs, others prefer different ones.
Making hard choices for an Epica show
It’s getting more and more difficult. It’s harder to make a solid setlist for each album, because the available time isn’t getting longer, it’s actually getting shorter.So you really have to make choices.
It was the first time we skipped Consign to Oblivion at the end. That felt quite strange for all of us. But in the end, it worked.
I was very positively surprised by the whole show.
That’s great to hear.
What it is to come after Ziggo?
I actually bought my ticket as soon as you announced it. It was in my app for a year. I really looked forward to seeing how you would perform on such a big stage. I’ve lived here since 2017, and I’ve seen you everywhere – from Bibelot in Dordrecht to AFAS, the Ziggo Dome, and Tivoli in Utrecht. So I’ve travelled quite a bit to see you, even in smaller venues. There was a lot of curiosity for me as well.
Right.
I hope the next tour will also stop at the Ziggo Dome. There’s still a lot in the proverbial pipeline. It’ll all be revealed.
The Carré shows are just the first anniversary shows. After that, more things may follow. But first we wanted to focus on these shows, of course.
The third show
They sold out in no time, which is super cool. And I read that some people unfortunately didn’t manage to get a ticket.
For the third show, which we were lucky to be able to add, people had a whole day to buy tickets.
So…
They could have.
They could have, yes.
But still – three times sold‑out Carré, almost sold‑out Ziggo Dome… What now?
Those are pretty big milestones when you look at it that way. It’s simply great that we can still do this after so many years as a band – that we can still keep adding milestones. Hopefully it’ll continue like this for another 25 years.
That would be amazing for me.
For me too.
Looking back to Aspiral
For me, it’s also a milestone to be there next year. Epica in Carré – when you live in the Netherlands, that’s really rare.
Yes, it’s very rare. That’s why it’s so nice it worked out.
I’d also like to talk about Aspiral, the latest album. I was really surprised by it – in a good way. You’re still in top form after 24 years, and you don’t lock yourselves into the same formula. That’s very hard not to do. It would be easier to say: we’ll just make “The Phantom Agony 2, 3, and 4,” and keep repeating ourselves.
So it’s good to really think and talk about where you want to go. It’s always exciting to try new things, because there are many people who always want to hear the same thing. But we write music and develop ourselves – whether people like it or not.
You change, your tastes change, your influences change, your life changes. So the music changes as well. We don’t think it’s necessary to repeat ourselves over and over. Sometimes the music changes more than usual. This time, we were really ready for something new. Not that this is automatically the new direction forever, but it is a different kind of record. We made a few bold choices. And they worked out well.
The power of Epica is…
Yes, absolutely. I imagine it’s also a challenge for you to make and release those kinds of songs. People always expect the same thing, and you can also shock them a bit.
I thought it was a good shock. The Alchemy Project, where we worked with a lot of other artists, really helped us believe in this approach. We found out that whatever genre or influence you bring in, as soon as you put these six people together, it always turns into Epica. The power of Epica is that we all write together, not just one person like in some other bands. That keeps the sound broad and varied, and allows us to go in many directions.
A snapshot of the present
That’s what makes it interesting. What I always love about artists is when they challenge themselves. Sometimes you don’t understand the music right away – and that’s a good thing, because it makes you listen more often until you understand the story. I had to get used to this record myself, but I really appreciate that this album is “Epica now,” not “old Epica.” To me, it really feels like a snapshot of the present.
It is. It’s a picture of where we are as a band at this moment. And I think we needed this in order to keep developing and stay relevant.
Epica keeps busy with…
To wrap up: What else is keeping you busy besides the Carré preparations? I know you can’t say much, so just share what you can.
I really can’t say too much yet. What I can say is that we still have a few festivals this summer, and in September we’ll finally play a small run in Asia – shows that were postponed from last year. Besides that, we’re very busy preparing for our anniversary year. And that’s not just the Carré shows. There will be many more things and announcements.
So you can start fantasizing about that. We’re so busy that I don’t think we’ll have time to breathe until we actually turn 25. And then we’ll start working on a new record. So things we definitely won’t be quiet.
Concluding…
Good.
We’re busy, but with fun things. We’ve basically opened a kind of playground where we can try all sorts of ideas. That keeps us young and eager. Over the coming year, you’ll hear what’s coming.
I trust you, Coen, so I’m not going to keep asking questions.
I couldn’t answer them anyway.
Exactly – I’d rather just fantasize, as you suggested.
Thank you very much for your time.